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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:36 pm 
Quote:
Quote: from MrPP on 4:50 pm on Oct. 1, 2005
TRIPP: Hogwarsh! The first two, INDEPENDENT published attempts after the original, announced success at cold fusion VALIDATED the findings! All THREE WERE WRONG!!! It certainly took the "scientific method" a month or two to work against the race for FAME!!!

All of your SWAGS re "respiration" have some basis in valid science. BUT, Where's the EVIDENCE??? Where's the chemical analyses of of all that "salt" - QUALitative AND QUANtitative??? Where are the AIR analyses showing ion and molecular content TODAY??? ALL of the sufaces in chambers and shafts are FAR from the heated, exterior surfaces. So, absent high air flows, these would be cool surfaces. But, absent significant air flows, no salt can get INTO the chambers to deposit there! And you're saying that the GP actually "inhales" AND "exhales" so that more salt can come in with the next "breath"??? AND, could you explain "exudation" to me. A HARD stone, over time, with NO "driving forces" PREFERENTIALLY "exudes" some portion of it's mineral content??? Stalactites and stalagmites take ratios of thousands or millions of water/limestone to form, while a harder stone simply sits there - DRY - and "exudes" one or more of it's ingredients??? Wouldn't it lose it's crystalline structure and COLLAPSE???

ALSO, would you go over your last several posts and assign probabilities of being true IN THE GP to each of your speculative, scientific wild-a**ed guesses so that others might get a feel for (or calculate) the probability of ALL of your SWAGs being true and that you are RIGHT??? (I DO hope that others have electronic calculators or software that will carry out to at least nine points after the decimal in looking for a significant number.)

And, TRIPP, I find it IRONICALLY hilarious and hilariously IRONIC that YOU are forced to beg for TIME for all the sodium chloride soldiers to form ranks, march into the GP, and gratiously deposit themselves upon the cool inner surfaces. NO SWEAT! Your "opponents" are willing to grant you THOUSANDS of ADDITIONAL years for your little salt puppets to get INTO the GP!!! But then, every salt dummy has to take an oath to NOT climb above a certain elevation once inside!!! Oh, Gawd, it THIS "better thing through chemistry"!!! Oh, no! I've gotta quit - I'm suffering a severe case of Establishment humor side-splitting!


I was mistaken before. I now know the Truth. I have realized the identity of our MrPP. It is none other than Sean Osborne with his trademark posturing.

You know, MrPP, if you were to attend Geology101 dressed in black mystical robes, pointed hat and spouting Velikovsky you would be a source of considerable humor and release from the drudgery of science.

<img src="http://www.sacredsites.com/images/order.jpg">

Imagine water half way up the sides of this inspiring pyramid. That would truly be a deluge. You would think anyone serious about such a theory would contour such a level on the surrounding topography to see what this volume of water would involved.


  
 
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:02 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
Posts: 165
Location: Georgia
TRIPP: Not a big difficulty for a DIRECTIONAL tsunami. You must be thinking of your religious "flood"??? Not I.


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:09 pm 
A one time directional tsunami would leave more salt on these blocks than exudation or precipitation over centuries? I think it is you who is trying to make me laugh. Besides, you miss a very crucial, salient point in your wigglings here: the point of these authors trying to assert there was a water level half way up the pyramid (standing water) was to indicate it happened at a much earlier time when the planetary water levels were much higher... and not a one time. brief 'flood' event.


  
 
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:48 am 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
Posts: 165
Location: Georgia
TRIPP: There is an Establishment-accepted time when ocean levels all around the planet were 400 feet higher than at present???


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PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:45 pm 

Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 2:34 am
Posts: 39
Quote:
Quote: from MrPP on 4:48 am on Oct. 3, 2005
TRIPP: There is an Establishment-accepted time when ocean levels all around the planet were 400 feet higher than at present???



From our friends at <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_level_rise" target="_blank">W</a>ikipedia

<blockquote><hr><b><font size=+1> "Sea Level Rise"</font></b>
<img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1d/Post-Glacial_Sea_Level.png/300px-Post-Glacial_Sea_Level.png" align="right">Sea level rise is an increase in sea level. Multiple complex factors may influence such changes.

The sea level has risen more than 120 metres since the peak of the last ice age about 18,000 years ago. The bulk of that occurred before 6000 years ago. From 3000 years ago to the start of the 19th century sea level was almost constant, rising at 0.1 to 0.2 mm/yr; <img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/0/0f/Recent_Sea_Level_Rise.png/300px-Recent_Sea_Level_Rise.png" align="right"> since 1900 the level has risen at 1 to 3 mm/yr [1]; since 1992 satellite altimetry from TOPEX/Poseidon indicates a rate of about 3 mm/yr [2]. This change may be the first signs of the effect of global warming on sea level, which is predicted to cause significant rises in sea level over the course of the twenty-first century.


<b>Local and eustatic sea level</b>

Water cycles between ocean, atmosphere, and glaciers.Local mean sea level (LMSL) is defined as the height of the sea with respect to a land benchmark, averaged over a period of time, such as a month or a year, long enough that fluctuations caused by waves and tides are largely removed. One must adjust perceived changes in LMSL to take into account vertical movements of the land, which can be of the same order (mm/yr) as sea level changes. Some land movements occur due the isostatic adjustment of the mantle to the melting of ice sheets at the end of the last ice age. Atmospheric pressure (the inverse barometer effect), ocean currents and local ocean temperature changes can all affect LMSL.

Eustatic change (as opposed to local change) results in an alteration to the global sea levels, such as changes in the volume of water in the world oceans or changes in the volume of an ocean basin.


<b>Longer term changes</b>

<img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/c/c0/Sea_level_temp_140ky.gif/300px-Sea_level_temp_140ky.gif" align="right"> Sea level changes and relative temperaturesVarious factors affect the volume or mass of the ocean, leading to long-term changes in eustatic sea level. The two primary influences are temperature (because the volume of water depends on temperature), and the mass of water locked up on land and sea as fresh water in rivers, lakes, glaciers, polar ice caps, and sea ice. Over much longer (geological) timescales, changes in the shape of the ocean basins and in land/sea distribution will affect sea level.

Observational estimates are that the rise in sea level due to rising temperature is about 1 mm/yr over recent decades. Observational and modelling studies of glaciers and ice caps indicate a contribution to sea-level rise of 0.2 to 0.4 mm/yr averaged over the 20th century.

<b> Past Changes In Sea Level</b>

The sedimentary record

<img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/1e/Holocene_Sea_Level.png/300px-Holocene_Sea_Level.png" align="right">For generations, geologists have been trying to explain the obvious cyclicity of sedimentary deposits observed everywhere we look. The prevailing theories hold that this cyclicity primarily represents the response of depositional processes to the rise and fall of sea level. In the rock record, geologists see times when sea level was astoundingly low alternating with times when sea level was much higher than today, and these anomalies often appear worldwide. For instance, during the depths of the last ice age 18,000 years ago when hundreds of thousands of cubic miles of ice was stacked up on the continents as glaciers, sea level was 390 feet (120 m) lower, locations that today support coral reefs were left high and dry, and coastlines were miles farther basinward from the present-day coastline. It was during this time of very low sea level that there was a dry land connection between Asia and Alaska over which humans are believed to have migrated to North America (see Bering Land Bridge).

<b>However, for the past 6000 years (long before mankind started keeping written records) the world's sea level has been gradually approaching the level we see today. During the previous interglacial about 120,000 years ago, sea level was for a short time about 6 m higher than today</b>, as evidenced by wave-cut notches along cliffs in the Bahamas. There are also Pleistocene coral reefs left stranded about 3 meters above today's sea level along the southwestern coastline of West Caicos Island in the British West Indies. These once-submerged reefs and nearby paleo-beach deposits are silent testament that sea level spent enough time at that higher level to allow the reefs to grow (exactly where this extra sea water came from—Antarctica or Greenland—has not yet been determined). Abundant similar evidence of geologically recent sea level positions can be found around the world.


<hr></blockquote>

Incidentally, I am not one to believe these recent changes in sea level are from "global warming" or more accurately not necessarily from "grenhouse gas emission induced global warming".

MrPP the point here in the argument in that article is not that sea level rose suddenly at any point in time, but that it rose thousands of years ago to envelop the Great Pyramid, thereby making its age far older than established by egyptologists.

The article's claim of the water level half way up the pyramid is obviously not all that well thought out, even rationally (ignoring the interpretation of any evidence). The implication in the article is that the pyramid was built at some time *BEFORE* the sea level rose and then it fell again to current levels. This would imply the pyramid was built long before the last glaciatioon <b>AND ALSO IMPLY that water levels STILL have not risen back to that prvious level at which the pyramid was flooded,</b> thereby puttinmg the construction of the pyramid long before the last glaciation.

This even ignores that interglacial water levels, indicated above, at their peak about 120,000 years ago, were still only some 6 meters higher than their peak today. This is still far below the +400 meter level indicated in that article.

Referencing that article again, <a href="http://www.sacredsites.com/africa/egypt/great_pyramid.html" target="_blank">The Great Pyramid, Egypt</a>:<blockquote><hr>The Great Pyramid was originally encased in highly polished, smooth white limestone and capped, according to legend, by a perfect pyramid of black stone, probably onyx. Covering an area of 22 acres the white limestone casing was removed by an Arab sultan in AD 1356 in order to build mosques and fortresses in nearby Cairo. Herodotus, the great Greek geographer, visited in the fifth century BC. Strabo, a Greco / Roman historian, came in the first century AD. Abdullah Al Mamun, son of the Caliph of Baghdad, forced the first historically recorded entrance in AD 820, and Napoleon was spellbound when he beheld the fantastic structure in 1798.
- - - - - - - -
Herodotus, visiting in the fifth century BC, reported that inscriptions of strange characters were to be found on the pyramid's casing stones. In AD 1179 the Arab historian Abd el Latif recorded that these inscriptions were so numerous that they could have filled "more than ten thousand written pages." William of Baldensal, a European visitor of the early fourteenth century, tells how the stones were covered with strange symbols arranged in careful rows. Sadly, in 1356, following an earthquake that leveled Cairo, the Arabs robbed the pyramid of its beautiful casing of stones to rebuild mosques and fortresses in the city. As the stones were cut into smaller pieces and reshaped, all traces of the ancient inscriptions were removed from them. A great library of ageless wisdom was forever lost.
<hr></blockquote>

Do you REALLY IMAGINE that the casing stones remained in tact and with their outer inscriptions still present AND LEGIBLE all those centuries, some 120,000 years or more? This pushes the levels of credibility even beyond the concept that alien gods assisted in the construction of these pyramids.



(Edited by Tripp at 11:21 am on Oct. 3, 2005)


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 3:14 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 3:52 am
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Location: Portugal
"Do you REALLY IMAGINE that the casing stones remained in tact and with their outer inscriptions still present AND LEGIBLE all those centuries, some 120,000 years or more? This pushes the levels of credibility even beyond the concept that alien gods assisted in the construction of these pyramids. "

you have a point there. i've read somewhere that some of these "strange" inscriptions can still be found in the city of Cairo in some of the surviving original casing stones, but the inscriptions themselfs arent that misterious. they're graffiti written in several languages, which makes sense since the pyramids were standing there for thousands of years and were visited by many people. question is, were those inscriptions mainly graffiti or was there anything else? i believe Petri speaks about this in his book.

another thing i've read before, i supose recorded by some arab historian, is that the casing stones did present a darker outline several meters from the ground as if the pyramid had stood under water for a long time. i dont remember where i've read this nor do i know the validity of this information but i bet there is something about this in the internet somewhere.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 04, 2005 9:22 am 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
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Location: Georgia
The ancient human Egyptians - civil engineering geniuses that they were - built the GP from the capstone down, so that low-level stain is from the sweat of their brows. :)


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