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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 4:19 am 
Hello Brant...

I truly appreciate your enthusiasm and interest in Mars. Certainly a lot more information is about to become available from Odyssey shortly. Just yesterday, in fact, news came from Odyssey that confirms the presence of fluid water on the surface of Mars --- Something I myself announced as long ago as August 9, 2000.

(see the "News Flash" at end of this post)

Brant... You need to realize something about Sitchin's "<i>Lost Book of Enki</i>" : this book is a fictional work by Sitchin in which he has more lattitude to theorize and extrapolate on his research and create, through fantasy, a conceivable perspective on what *may* have been. There was never any clay entablature found that dictated these words from Enki.

You are right- One of the speculations Sitchin employs to add dram to "Lost Book Of Enki" is to speculate that the "face" on Mars in the Cydonia region may indeed be a monument to Allalu. Unfortunately, you may be unhappy to learn that I personally do not give the "face" and credibility as an artificial feature. I believe the face to be an entirely Aeolian, wind created form.

I recently had a lengthy exchange with someone on a board regarding the "face". Ironically this person "Lan" is also someone with whom I'm working in a group for applied analyses of the Mars Global Survey Magnetometer data.

You can view my exchange with Lan regarding the "Face" in Cydonia here: <a href="http://www.grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=77110&t=77110">The "Face On Mars" Follies</a>


******* N E W S -- F L A S H!! *******
For additional information, contact
Terry Nelson, (301) 419-3900
March 1, 2002 Email: tnelson@spherix.com


NASA'S ODYSSEY SUPPORTS VIKING EXPERIMENTER'S EARLY CLAIM TO LIQUID WATER ON CURRENT DAY MARS
Advances Claim to Life on Red Planet

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE:
BELTSVILLE, MD, March 1, 2002. NASA's report today that its spacecraft Odyssey detected extensive water ice on or near the surface of Mars was old but welcome news to Dr. Gilbert V. Levin, CEO of Spherix Incorporated (NASDAQ/SPEX), a technology innovations firm in Beltsville, Maryland. Ever since his life detection experiment landed on Mars aboard NASA's Viking Mission in 1976 (1-4), he has contended that liquid water exists on the surface of Mars. A few years ago, his son, Dr. Ron L. Levin, a physicist at MIT's Lincoln Laboratory, helped him develop a theoretical model showing how liquid water occurs on Mars. The validity of the model was then verified in experiments conducted by collaborating scientists at the University of California at Berkeley. Despite the experimental proof, the presence of liquid water was so key to the controversial issue of life on Mars that few NASA scientists acceded the point - but now Odyssey lends weight to Levin's claim. "If there is ice near or on the surface, there certainly is liquid water, as our model shows," Levin said.

The first direct evidence for liquid water on Mars came from Gilbert Levin's analysis of temperature measurements made on the footpad of Viking Lander 2. He noted that the soil temperature's rise with the sun halted at precisely the point at which ice turns into liquid water. While frequently discussing this significant finding with fellow scientists, Levin did not publish this evidence until his 1997 paper (5) on his continued analysis of the results of his Viking Labeled Release (LR) life detection test. Levin says the question of liquid water was lost in the controversy over the paper's conclusion that the LR had detected microbial life in the Martian soil.

As the ensuing debate heated up, however, the water issue moved to the fore. Many scientists rejected any possibility of living Martian microbes because of the widely reported absence of liquid water anywhere on the planet's surface. The liquid water issue reached the boiling point, both figuratively and literally, as these scientists maintained that the low atmospheric pressure on Mars forbade water in liquid form since it would, they said, instantly boil away. Here is where son Ron came in. Having accompanied his father at JPL throughout the Viking Mission as a student, Ron continued to be strongly interested in and supportive of his father's Martian travails. Having become a PhD physicist since Viking, Ron prepared a model demonstrating that the Martian atmospheric pressure, low as it is, together with the wide presence of surface ice at the Viking site, required that water occur as a liquid in the Martian topsoil for at least the part of the day when the surface temperature rose above freezing, which it did as measured by Viking and later by Pathfinder. Father and son published this model in 1998 (6), with Ron saying, "While there may be problems interpreting biology on Mars, it is certain that physics works the same there as here, and that means there is liquid water on Mars."


--OVER--

All during this time, the Levin senior, one by one, slayed the scientific dragons raised over the years to deny the validity of his claim to life on Mars. With the gradual acknowledgement by the scientific community that, where there is chemical activity, a source of energy and liquid water, there is life; water became the remaining barrier to Levin's claim. Investigating the matter, Dr. Larry Kuznetz and David Gan, of the University of California at Berkeley, ran laboratory experiments. They found that ice liquefies under Martian conditions as the temperature is slowly raised above freezing. Levin and Kuznetz presented the data and pictures in a publication (7) in 2000. In 2001, Levin brought current his case for life on Mars (8), and proposed a simple variation of his LR experiment that, he claims, could convince even those most resistant to life on the Red Planet. While some scientists began to take note, the consensus remained that it was impossible for liquid water to be on the surface of Mars. With NASA's own Odyssey finding ice so close to the surface, Levin is certain it has brought relief to his 26-year drought.

Commenting on this turn of events, Gilbert Levin said, "With the overcoming of this last barrier, I believe, it has become extremely difficult to deny, on scientific grounds, that the Viking LR experiment did, indeed, find microorganisms in the soil of Mars. From what we have learned since Viking, it is possible that they could be the same, or nearly the same, species that have recently been discovered thriving on Earth at places where liquid water is at least as scarce as it is on Mars. But, since they could be quite different, I think this will have a profound impact on NASA's plan to bring a sample of Martian soil to Earth. It seems to me that even a slight risk to our health and environment exceeds any likely benefit."

References:

<a href="http://www.grahamhancock.com/phorum/read.php?f=1&i=78670&t=78630">Fluid "Water' On Mars</a>

1. Levin, G.V., "Detection of Metabolically Produced Labeled Gas: The Viking Mars Lander," Icarus, 16, 153-166, 1972.
2. Klein, H.P. et al., "The Viking Biological Investigation: Preliminary Results," Science, 194, 4260, 99-105, October 1976.
3. Levin, G.V. and P.A. Straat, "Viking Labeled Release Biology Experiment: Interim Results," Science, 194, 1322-1329, December 1976.
4. Klein, H.P. et al., "The Viking Mission Search for Life on Mars," Nature, 262, 5563, 24-27, July 1976.
5. Levin, G.V., "The Viking Labeled Release Experiment and Life on Mars," Instruments, Methods, and Missions for the Investigation of Extraterrestrial Microorganisms, SPIE Proceedings, 3111, 146-161, July, 1997.
6. Levin, G.V. and R.L. Levin, "Liquid Water and Life on Mars," Instruments, Methods, and Missions for Astrobiology, SPIE Proceedings, 3441, 30-41, July, 1998.
7. Levin, G., L. Kuznetz, and A. Lafleur, "Approaches to Resolving the Question of Life on Mars," Instruments, Methods, and Missions for Astrobiology, SPIE Proceedings, 4137, 48-62, August 2000.
8. Levin, G., "Scientific Logic for Life on Mars," Instruments, Methods, and Missions for Astrobiology, SPIE Proceedings, 4495, 81-88, July 2001.

Our Internet address is http://www.spherix.com.

# # # # # #


  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 9:24 am 
Tripp,

Greetings! Yes, I am quite aware of the nature of Sitchin's book. And I see where you have allowed that Sitchin's effort is a "conceivable story of what 'may' have been." Except that you must realize one thing: Sitchin wrote the book as an Assyrian-style epic poem because he wished to express his definite, non-fictional views gleaned from his 30+ years of research into the ancient records. Yes, I know that there never were any tablets of Enki found; however, because he has never been able to find them but is adamantly convinced of their one-time existence, Sitchin has, if you will, created a "hologram" of them through the power of poetry.

It is a shame that we live in these fragmented times (so unlike, say, Sumerian times) when scientifically sound minds are wrongly taught that poetry is "just poetry" or "just something made up", as the artistic minds are so wrongly taught that "art is all about expressing your emotions". No. To both views. Yes, with poetry, we speculate; but speculate means "see" :O. Sitchin's "virtual Enki tablets" are meant to give us a total vision of the way things really were and really happened. The materials that Sitchin used to create his poem are the same materials he has used to create his documentations and histories. Even the very poetic/literary style that Sitchin employed for this end (see above) is based upon factual knowledge, not on "just something made up". The problem with the notion that poetry is "just something made up" is the word "just". Andy Lloyd, whom I've mentioned numerious times on this board now and who is also a rigorous scientific investigator, has also read "The Lost Book of Enki" and he was in disagreement with a few of Sitchin's views, too; he and I discussed them. My point is, Andy didn't fall into the trap of the word "just".

Anyway, I have my doubts about the "face on Mars", too, although I'm not yet completely sold on the idea that it's just the product of Aeolian winds. But I thought that you had mentioned to NorthWest Guy that there was some other "sphinx-like" object on Mars that few have seen, but that you had seen. Maybe I read you wrong.

Thanks for providing us with all of this great new information! Hope to see you posting again.


  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 9:52 am 
Tripp,

Hello, again. What do you think of the possibility that the "Face" is an artificial creation which is so old and weather-exposed that it has subsequently been eroded and distorted via the Aeolian winds' carving-activities and granular transport/depositing? Does that seem like something viable to you after all of your research?


  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2002 3:18 pm 
Bryan

You wrote
"<i>." Except that you must realize one thing: Sitchin wrote the book as an Assyrian-style epic poem because he wished to express his definite, non-fictional views gleaned from his 30+ years of research into the ancient records. </i>

AND
<i>"Sitchin's "virtual Enki tablets" are meant to give us a total vision of the way things really were and really happened. The materials that Sitchin used to create his poem are the same materials he has used to create his documentations and histories. </i>

YES in writing "<i>Lost Book of Enki</i> Sitchin was drawing on his previous works and research. and YES, the LBOE was written to demonstrate how things were........... HOWEVER this book is entirely <I>SPECULATIVE</i> and the prose style is irrelevant to "see" or demonstrating any "TRUTHS" or not.

As a speculative work, Sitchin is writing about how <i>THINGS MAY HAVE BEEN</i> by drawing details and information from disparate sources to give the book (and audience) coherent substance and appealing detail.

NO, Sitchin is was not writing de facto truths in any form NOR does any of his work suggest that these things may be true. There is not even any direct reference amidst the Sumerian entablature to habitation and employ of the planet Mars. I have spoken to Dr Sitchin on the phone. He phoned me on his own volition some months ago to speak about my own Mars research..and this was at the time that the shortly after "Face' in Cydonia had been re-imaged in high resulution and Sitchin was quite clearly seeking other means to tie in Mars and Earth.

No... I do not view the "face" in Cydonia as ever having been an artificial form -- neither wholly artificial in creation nor a morphologic landform which was subsequently altered with intelligent design.

The point of fact is.... the "face" mophology in Cydonia exhibits absolutely NO characteristics of any intelligent design whatsoever.. no reasonable symmetry.. no continuous line.. nothing......and actually every salient coherent image detail demonstrates powerfully that this feature is wholly natural in orginal, Aeolian in shape and very likely volcanic in primary structure.

The lack image detail and information as well as "flattering" lighting and shadow allowed the <i>impression</i> of a qasi-anthropomorphic facial feature at one time, however this was never conclusive. The most recent high resulution image of the face in full lighting demonstrates quite clearly an utter lack of detail *anywhere* exhibiting any sort of intelligent, intended design.

While the face once "spoke" to us powerfully in that it was a very appealing feature, allowing us to physically imagine other similar beings on another world with a very human-like face, the face also speaks of our ready ability to recognize familiar shape and form where none may exist.


  
 
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2006 8:49 pm 
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Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:17 pm
Posts: 26
Hi Tripp,

I've read through the thread and didn't see you mention where "The Port" photos originated from, can they be found publically online?


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2006 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 05, 2007 12:48 pm
Posts: 143
Location: Piney Woods of East Texas
i hope to see the pics at some point.
\MOON!
i seem to have forgotten that the volume of the moon and the volume of the pacific ocean are the same...hmmmmm
http://www.moonphases.info/

(i'll be inserting this interesting tidbit in the threads where the moon shows up. so feel free to inore it if you see it again. or don't.)


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