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PostPosted: Wed May 24, 2006 11:05 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
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Location: Georgia
No problem with the twin/binary companion star theory. BUT, such pairs do a dance in THEIR OWN PAIR-DETERMINED plane, so neither would ever cross the "planetary plane" of the other. The Anunnaki "maps" and stories clearly describe Niburu's "crossing" several times. Plus, both the catastrophes (per V.) and the existing anomalies and perturbations (per astronomers) were most likely caused by a physical body careening around the Solar System.

I put the last passage of Niburu around the Sun at about 1600 BC. It should have been here by now. Spotted it yet?

We will all be safely dead and not know "WRONG!", but Lloyd will have collected and spent all his royalties from an assumption of an orbit of 10,000+ years.

I predict that 4,982,000 years from now, the Milky Way will pass a Black Hole and Pluto will be sucked in. Should I write a book???

You sed, "...if Nibiru is following the proposed orbit and is now gone ..." Nib WAS following it's old orbit, but due to the position of the planets on it's last loop around the Sun, it passed too close to Jupiter, CHANGING it's direction and speed, such that it's velocity was greater than "escape velocity" and it PERMANENTLY left the Solar System.


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PostPosted: Thu May 25, 2006 5:42 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 3:52 am
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Location: Portugal
"No problem with the twin/binary companion star theory. BUT, such pairs do a dance in THEIR OWN PAIR-DETERMINED plane, so neither would ever cross the "planetary plane" of the other. "

no, the twins will never cross each other's plane, but... their planets will. the seven moons of "Nibiru" are in fact the seven planets that orbit the Dark Star. Loyd proposes that Nibiru, the planet of the crossing, the "ferry", is actualy the 7th planet of the Dark Star which seems to cross the plain of the ecliptic but at a weird angle from the other planets. this happens when the DS comes near the outter area of our solar system, just outside the Kuiper Belt.

"I put the last passage of Niburu around the Sun at about 1600 BC. It should have been here by now. Spotted it yet?"

nope, but im not an astronomer so im not looking for it. by the way, have you ever read Harrington's paper on planet X?

"I predict that 4,982,000 years from now, the Milky Way will pass a Black Hole and Pluto will be sucked in. Should I write a book???"

well, if you put it that way... Sitchin did almost the same thing. he picked up a very very old story written by a long gone civilization and theorized that what it "truly" represents is in fact an astronomy historical record of events that happened millions of years ago. if you want to write a book based on suppositions you can, you wouldnt be the first nor the last one.

"You sed, "...if Nibiru is following the proposed orbit and is now gone ..." Nib WAS following it's old orbit, but due to the position of the planets on it's last loop around the Sun, it passed too close to Jupiter, CHANGING it's direction and speed, such that it's velocity was greater than "escape velocity" and it PERMANENTLY left the Solar System."

well, thats a theory no doubt. but just because we cannot see if Nibiru is coming it doesnt mean it is not coming or that it isnt there at all, or even that we understand what it truly is. i have no preconceived ideas on this subject and im waiting for evidence that can prove it either way.

best regards


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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2006 7:15 am 
Just sticking my nose here so you guys can "bite it off."

What if--if, mind you--that Nibiru (or whatever people want to call it) is known to exist, but it is being kept under wraps by whomever (your conspiratorial choice)?

Is it possible that such a body existing can be kept a global secret?


  
 
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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2006 6:18 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 3:52 am
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Location: Portugal
hey Wallis,

before replying to you i want to make a point first. something that i believe should be said regarding all that has been said in this and other threads.

Quote:
“The illustrations on the cylinder seals have for this reason generally defied attempts to understand them in detail. They refer to mythological material otherwise lost... In each, there is a clear representation of some celestial object--a central circle, or sphere, surrounded by other, generally smaller circles or spheres.

In the upper left-hand illustration of Figure 33-5, we see that the central circle is surrounded by rays and can quite clearly be identified as a sun or star. But what are we to make of the other objects surrounding each star? It is at least a natural assumption that they represent the planets. But the idea of planets circling suns and stars is an idea which essentially originated with Copernicus--although some earlier speculations along these lines were mentioned in ancient Greece.

The cylinder seal in the upper left-hand corner of Figure 33-5 shows, curiously enough, nine planets circling the prominent sun in the sky (and two smaller planets, off to one side). The other representations of planetary systems—if we may call them this--show, remarkably, a variation in the numbers of planets per star. In some of the cylinder seals, a star and accompanying planets seem to be associated with a particular deity.”


fig. 33-5, in case you're wondering, pertains to the following very famous sumerian tablet:

Image

and the quote is part of an interesting discussion of the sumerian civilization and particularly their texts, legends and pictorials where descriptions of various cylinder seals are tied in with the planets much in the same way Sitchin did in his first book TTP.

the only difference is that the above text was written by Carl Sagan. of the sumerian civilization he also had this to say:

Quote:
I feel that if Sumerian civilization is depicted by the descendants of the Sumerians themselves to be of non-human origin, the relevant legends should be examined carefully. I do not claim that the following is necessarily an example of extraterrestrial contact, but it is the type of legend that deserves more careful study. Taken at face value, the legend suggests that contact occurred between human beings and a non-human civilzsation of immense powers on the shores of the Persian Gulf, perhaps near the site of the ancient Sumerian city of Eridu, and in the fourth millennium B.C. or earlier.


this was written 10 years before Sitchin's TTP.interesting no? this brings me to the following point, Carl Sagan knew of the validity of such ideas and thought of them well enough as to include them in his earlier works, on later books more subreptitiously but they were there hidden under speculation and symbolism. the problem is, he was an hypocrite, he chose a "career" instead of the ostracism, the persecution and the ridicule that following these kind of ideas would make him endure. that was his right, of course, but on the other hand i condone his mediatic image of scientific rigour and persecutor of fringe thought in any form as portrayed in "Demon Hunted World" and in academic circles. particularly when Sagan himself knew of the implications of the available evidence, that is the utmost hypocrisy.

but enough with Sagan allready, he just served to make a point, a very important one. you do not need an enourmous ammount of work to make such a conspiracy a reality. to make it work you only need the right people with enough power, endoctrination and the stupidity of human kind giving a helping hand. the ridicule factor is the main thrust and the fundamental reason why these theories are never taken seriously. people like Lune and other pseudo skeptics are just epiphenomenons of the rotten pseudo "rationalized" world we live in.

Lune said: "The AA question is very interesting one and one that I think MAY have occurred"

Lune, if you're still around i just want to tell you this: you're an hypocrite. you said you wanted to "discuss" ideas but what you want is to pose as a sort of enlightned skeptic, but you're neither enlightned nor a true skeptic. if you really do think AA may have happened then you're even a bigger hypocrite because you set out to punch holes into others ideas when at the same time never presented your own. and when asked to show your BS you run away while spewing senseless rethoric around?

like Sagan, Lune feels the need to attack and ridicule those who dare to think outside conventional understanding. after all this is a society striving more and more each day for packaged thought and the standardization of human mentalities. he feels his "academic understanding" is the mold everyone should fit upon. for Lune and others like him, if academia says its true then by god it must be true.

bahh, im wasting my time again. such specimens of human kind arent even worth the trouble.

Wallis, i hope that you saw in the text above the answer to your question. believe me its in there.

(Edited by outcast at 3:27 pm on May 29, 2006)


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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2006 11:24 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
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Location: Georgia
No mention of the "planet" in the middle of the seal - straight out from the nose of the middle guy? 12 + Sun?


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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2006 11:27 pm 
Outcast,

Appreciated the response. Remember that seal as if it is imprinted on my brain.

Interesting words from Sagan, as I had not read them before.

Also interesting is the fact that the Chinese emperors from nearly the beginning of their civilization believed that they descended from the "gods," as well as the Japanese belief that their Emperor descended from the "gods." Even the Koreans have a myth that a son of heaven transformed a bear into a human female who gave birth to all Koreans.

Seems that, while the Asian people are a "later" addition to the human family, there is a lot of tradition that points back to an original source.

So, back to my "way out of the box thinking," if I read your response correctly, there is more than a miniscule chance that the existence of Nibiru is being kept under wraps.


  
 
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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 8:22 am 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
Posts: 165
Location: Georgia
OUTCAST: I forgot to thank you for posting the seal and the old comments by Two-faced Sagan. Don't get me started on him - my hatred is inhumanely deep.

WALLIS: I hate conspiracy theories in general. Let me ask what would happen to the major western religions IF it were shown that all the "God stuff" is misrecalled "gods stuff"? Would monotheism - as we know it - collapse? In the U.S., would Christianity collapse? Sans religion, would the citizenry become unmanageable by the U.S. government? Might my government, Christianity, and Uniformitarianism/Establishment Science ALL THREE have reasons to keep squashed all considerations of Niburu and the Anunnaki on Earth, creating Man (multiple times and places, Asians one of the last few)? OR, might a new religion emerge quickly enough to avoid social catastrophe? Creator-of-the-Universe-ism, or whatever?


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 1:39 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 21, 2005 4:15 pm
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Location: Houston, Texas
Greetings,
i already see the decline of religion in the hypocrisy of its leaders and the constant alterations to fit the changes of mankind. i believe in the conspiracy theories that suppress the truth of mankind's past for the purpose of selfish gain. Conspiracies that are being, slowly, revealed as truth and summarily altered/demolished. By studying mankind's amazing ability to adapt to change i am led to believe that we will survive the revelation that religion is all based on falsehoods of true past, and we will, if we can learn to work as one world, advance into interstellar travelers and also be able to survive the natural catastrophies that are bound to occur. Dr. Sitchin is a very important catalyst in this progression because his courage to challenge the lies of history in search of the answer to what is still the true question. "Who am i, and where do i come from?"


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 6:05 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 04, 2005 3:52 am
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<i>"So, back to my "way out of the box thinking," if I read your response correctly, there is more than a miniscule chance that the existence of Nibiru is being kept under wraps."</i>

Wallis, in a way, yes, i'd have to say that the fundamental truth about Nibiru and what it represents is kept under wraps, a very tight wrap. as long as this general and very vague idea is thrusted only by the amalgamation and disparaging views of "conspiracy theorists" and "fringe believers" (the other side of this being the close minded idiocy of pseudo skepticism) of every color everywhere, confusion will remain and the truth will not be known.

on the other hand, those in the know have never kept this a secret in the true sense of the word. they have plastered their most esoteric and inner knowlledge in plain sight of everyone. their symbolism when truly understood is plain as day. its everywhere. for everyone to see but for the few to understand.

those in the know still pledge alliegeance to the same old gods of millenia past. christianic symbolism is filled with imagery from old egyptian and babylonian rites and this is just one example. our cities are architectured around ancient symbolism of which modern people have no understanding.

skeptics will say that this is all conspiracy theories, that dirty word the "conspiracy", well damn them all, i dont give a crap what they think. look again, but this time really open your eyes and specially your mind:

Image

can you see it? this is just an example that follows the path of my last post. but it truly is everywhere.
they know its true, we know its true and noone will trully admit it. they dont care that we know and we cannot make them accept that they knew it allready. its a vicious circle.

besides, the Lunes (the Loonies?) are out there, they are part of the system, they will persecute you for your ideas, they will make you loose your job if need be, they will silence your words from the media outlets if you get too close to the truth and if you do get to the media outlets they will set you apart through ridicule.

<i>OUTCAST: I forgot to thank you for posting the seal and the old comments by Two-faced Sagan. Don't get me started on him - my hatred is inhumanely deep.
</i>

believe me MrP, i know perfectly what you mean. but i guess he had to do what he had to do and i think in the end he got the answers he was searching for. unfortunetly he never exposed them overtly for the betterment of his fellow humans. i will allways condone him for that.

<i>By studying mankind's amazing ability to adapt to change i am led to believe that we will survive the revelation that religion is all based on falsehoods of true past, and we will, if we can learn to work as one world, advance into interstellar travelers and also be able to survive the natural catastrophies that are bound to occur</i>

Mouton, i dont share your optimism but i really do hope that what you said can happen, for our own sake.


(Edited by outcast at 3:08 pm on May 30, 2006)


(Edited by outcast at 3:09 pm on May 30, 2006)


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 9:12 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
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OC: Establishment Science castrated Velikovsky's influence long before they got around to Sitchin - but using the same worst-of-propaganda techniques.

MB: I'm with you, but have far less optimism than you. Have you read Neil Freer?


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PostPosted: Tue May 30, 2006 9:38 pm 
Mouton, long time no hear!

The premise of religion being proven as falsehoods reminds me of one of David Clarke's novels where these aliens come to Earth with "videos" of the past and prove that just about everything people believed was wrong, wrong, wrong. And--the kicker--these inhabitants were the last generation to live on the planet. So, according to Clarke, what did the last survivors of the human race do? They partied and enjoyed one another's company until the day they all expired: into nothingness, no afterlife, nothing.

Personally, I feel that religion is an aspiring thought. Something "out there" has to be a whole lot better than what I have "here and now."

I would agree that for many, many people: should the "proverbial rug" be pulled out from under their beliefs that they would spiral downward into despair. Yet, if I were to just cite one generic example whereby people believed certain leaders so whole-heartedly about the specific end of the world, when their leaders failed so many of their followers continued unhesitantly, undeterred, in their beliefs. There will be many who will "bail out" without a parachute, there will be others who will "stick it out" regardless of facts, and there will be others who will smile and regard the essence of that other reality being more important that the reality of day-to-day living.

Kind of like many of us who are interested in Nibiru, its concept, its facts, its "legends," et al. Regardless of what is eventually proven as fact, nothing will dispel all of the hopes, speculations, aspirations, etc. from all of the people.

Outcast: a "subliminal" message from Sagan (the image you posted)? That was great!


  
 
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2006 12:09 pm 
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Location: Houston, Texas
Greetings:

Outcast;
The surest way to overcome the suppression of truth is education. To be able to educate the masses we would need a new method of communication, beyond today's "Media Control", that can reach masses of people simultaneously. {An idea to ponder}

i admit, it took thousands of years for life to become this way, so i should not expect a change overnight but, we have an advantage (those of us that know). Don't worry, when it is time, the people will be willing to hear.

Yes, i saw Ra w/Sagan.


Mr. P.
It took me a while but, now i understand what you mean by "Ignorant Design" and, i can see how it can dim one's hopes. Consider this; if all things have an exact opposite, then this is simply a matter of flipping the tiles.

i haven't heard of Neil Freer but, i will know him by my next post.


Wallis;
i prefer the idea of worshipping in spirit and in truth. Worship being the acknowledgement of the spirit that dwells in me and all life in the truth of who we are, where we come from, and what we can do.

What you say is true of believers; some will run, some will stay, some will remain deaf, dumb, and blind. It is the desire and continued pursuit of truth by those like Dr. Sitchin and ourselves that keeps me hopeful.


i leave with a question, what is the meaning of the eight rayed sun?


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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2006 5:35 pm 

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Quote:
Quote: from Wallis on 6:38 pm on May 30, 2006

Outcast: a "subliminal" message from Sagan (the image you posted)? That was great!


Wallis, exactly!! guess from which book that image is the backcover of?? none other than Contact, his last book. smart fellow that Sagan was, unfortunetly like MrP said, also a two faced one.


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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2006 8:18 pm 

Joined: Thu Sep 22, 2005 9:35 pm
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As most of you know, I'm still in the process of meshing Sitchin's departure of the Anunnaki and Velikovsky's "Comet Venus", these - to my mind - occurring in the 1700-1500 BCE period.

Let me throw another variable into the conversation which - it seems to me - supports aspects of the positions of each of you. V. theorized that, after two close encounters of Earth and the comet Venus, Mankind suffered a "mass amnesia" which completely confused the inherited cultural history, beliefs, etc. If we back up to before then and add in Sitchin's sudden abandonment of Mankind (leaving because of the then-predictable close-and-searing approach of the comet??), then we have multiple causes for emotional trauma, etc.

My hypothesis seemingly requires that Nib passed too close to Jupiter when it ENTERED the plane of the planets, sucked out it's core which became the COMET Venus, and, because they foresaw the change in their orbit, the Anunns hauled butt home before it exited both the plane of the planets AND the Solar System (due to angular velocity > escape velocity?)

The "mass amnesia" theory certainly makes a viable theory for transitioning from being abject slaves for technologically-superior aliens to worshipping now-unseen gods whom we hope (foolishly) will return.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2006 3:06 am 
Mr. PP, have you read Claustrophobia yet, by Barbara Hand Claw?


  
 
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